Comments on: IRS Wealth Statistics Paint Fascinating Picture of Top One Percent https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/ Actionable Insights from Small Business CPAs Mon, 04 Mar 2019 14:19:47 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.9.4 By: Steve https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-5201 Tue, 02 Jan 2018 15:11:12 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-5201 In reply to Jo Ann.

I think the numbers would include any taxpayer with a “tax return profile” during the survey years that indicates the individual’s net worth falls into the top .25%. So it should include celebrities who have tax returns that indicate they have a high net worth.

The one thing we probably all know about those folks, though, is that their high incomes often are short-lived. A professional athlete, e.g., can make $5M a year… but as I calculated in another blog post (link below), she or he needs to live on “only” $500K and then save whatever else is leftover after taxes in order to be able to “retire” after 7-8 years and continue to live on $500K a year.

http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/financial-planning-for-top-one-percent/

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By: Jo Ann https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-5195 Tue, 02 Jan 2018 02:04:53 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-5195 My understanding of the above scenarios is limited. I do wonder, however, how many professional athletes and entertainers are included in the above numbers and if they were excluded from the data, would the ratios be the same.

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By: Steve https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-5188 Mon, 01 Jan 2018 14:25:55 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-5188 In reply to Jennifer.

Good comments Jennifer. Thank you for sharing. Happy New Year to you and your family, too. 🙂

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By: Jennifer https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-5187 Mon, 01 Jan 2018 05:22:41 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-5187 Hi Steve,

I fall into the under $5 mil category and the numbers are dead on! The “low” amounts in Retirement Accounts are due to the Maximum being put into a Sep every year for 30 years from the income on a “pass-through ” business. We also bought rental properties and a building to house our business which will provide rental income for our upcoming retirement. Passive Investments are something we use, my husband and I are both Financial Advisors and know lower costs lead to better returns, Index Funds are our favorites. The high amount of cash on hand is due to having available funds to replace income in down markets and during slow business cycles And/OR an opportunity to invest in another property. We have mortgages on our first and second homes as we don’t believe in putting cash on hand into a ” dead” asset, especially at 3.75% with a tax deduction. We believe our money will earn more outside a house. I drive a 2012 Toyota Highlander, my husband a leased Jaguar. No one would ever think we are “1%” Frankly, I didn’t realize it until I read your article, we both started with literally nothing and slowly and steadily it grew. We always lived below our means and don’t buy crap we don’t need. We’ve been able to start and fund 529’s for grandkids, nieces and nephews at $50 a month (x5) We also give at least 15% of our income to various charities and I’m in the process of getting a charity I started up and running. We will always have more in common with ( and more fun with) the average working class person as that is the way we see ourselves (I worked in a stable from the time I was 8-21 and I tended bar all through college and my husband worked in a diner and retail for years) . I have more fun with the wait staff at a party than the guests. The presumptions people have about people in any “category” is pretty comical. You CAN’T judge a book by its cover…or its Assets! : ) Happy New Year and thank you for a great article.

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By: Steve https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-5156 Fri, 29 Dec 2017 19:50:01 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-5156 In reply to Deborah Dawn.

Interesting thoughts Deborah. And I appreciate you taking the time to share them.

My experience serving wealthy and the entrepreneurial class? I don’t think the wealthy “know” this stuff better than the common man or woman on the street. But I do think the statistics suggest they do more “hands-on” investing… and that that gives them (in best cases) a way to build real wealth.

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By: Deborah Dawn https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-5145 Thu, 28 Dec 2017 23:45:45 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-5145 Steve, regarding items #5 & #7, “what everybody should be thinking” is not that skipping retirement accounts (and mutual funds) isn’t smart, but instead WHY are the top 1% avoiding these vehicles and should I follow their lead? Do the wealthy have reason to believe their taxes will be lower in the future? Prolonging the receipt of compensation now is akin to borrowing from someone notoriously bad with managing money (i.e. government) and allowing them to set repayment terms later, based solely upon what THEY need in the future. (Have you seen our national debt, unfunded Medicare, Medicaid, social security, etc? I think they will be pretty needy.) Aside from that, retirement plans and mutual funds in particular are a scam, played upon the common man, by Wall Street. There is rampant insider trading, back-dating of trades and almost no oversight, prosecution, or penalties from the SEC. (Read “Pirates of Manhattan”.) Returns are being grossly overstated using a figure “average rate of return” which doesn’t correlate to anything but makes returns look good. The average rate of return over two years of a fund that has a 100% return, then a -50% return is reported as a positive 25%. Yet $10,000 invested, grown at 100% to $20,000, then subject to a 50% loss leaves an investor at $10,000—a ZERO % return. The more volatile the fund/stock, the more overstated its actual return. Target date funds are designed to keep the average person’s eye OFF the ball and to steer large numbers of institutional (retirement plan) investors into the same investments where Wall Street has better control rather than let crazy novices invest irrationally and cause market unpredictability. The only thing holding up our wildly overpriced stock market right now is employer’s automatic enrollment (and auto escalation) features in 401ks. These guarantees a continuous supply of unsophisticated money to fund the giant Ponzi Scheme. The wealthy know you don’t play games with people who can easily cheat you.

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By: Howard Bernstein https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-4891 Fri, 15 Dec 2017 19:41:49 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-4891 Re: Insight #7

The low proportion in mutual funds does not necessarily indicate so small an allocation to passive investments. Per the data definitions (https://www.irs.gov/statistics/soi-tax-stats-personal-wealth-study-terms-and-concepts), Diversified Mutual Funds only includes, “mutual funds that are broadly composed of a variety of different kinds of investment instruments. Also includes mutual funds whose asset composition could not be determined.” Thus, the low value here may indicate only that the wealthy don’t buy funds that allocate across different asset types, which is to be expected.

Publicly Traded Stock includes domestic and foreign stock mutual funds, ETFs and individual issues. held in taxable accounts. Those holdings make up 10.75% of assets in the under $5 million category. Add the 12.37% Retirement Assets, a significant proportion of which may well be in passive investments at the bottom tier, and we’re over 23%.

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By: Brendan https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-4890 Fri, 15 Dec 2017 15:41:04 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-4890 In reply to Steve.

Yes was about to make the exact same comment ragrding retirement plans–many of these wealthy individuals may be pulling in several million per year but only able to sock away exactly the same as the rest of us in retirement plans.
So, in other words, that statistic isn’t puzzling at all but just confirms that these folks play by the same rules as we do.
What is puzzling is why they don’t all participate! I know if you make $5M that deducting 18k isn’t much, it don’t leave $$ on the table!
My bet is that their “savy financial advisors” have convinced them not to participate but rather invest more in the lucrative (and fee-rich) hedge fund

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By: Steve https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-4889 Fri, 15 Dec 2017 04:34:14 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-4889 In reply to Harry Sit.

Those are good points, Harry, about the nonlinear scaling and influence of time… Good points. Thanks for sharing them.

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By: Steve https://evergreensmallbusiness.com/irs-wealth-statistics-paint-fascinating-picture-top-one-percent/#comment-4887 Thu, 14 Dec 2017 20:03:23 +0000 http://evergreensmallbusiness.com/?p=6174#comment-4887 In reply to Alan.

Good comments. Thank you Alan.

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